I’m due to pick up our male Frenchie puppy this Thursday. He’s Kennel Club registered and we paid about £1,300. From reading through this forum, I’ve been getting more and more interested in the breeding side of things, specifically the pedigree and genetics of our pup.
Naive as I was, I thought KC registered meant everything would be fine...
I’m absolutely gobsmacked—after checking the parents' mating, I discovered such a high inbreeding coefficient (27%) that it actually required a special dispensation from the breed club.
Could you tell me what my options are regarding the breeder? Because, naturally, I’ve already put down a deposit.
In the case of a dispensation (the puppy is meant to be pedigree, so the breeder must have obtained one), what criteria do they actually look at?
I’ve got two young children and I don’t want to find myself with an unstable dog or one that dies prematurely...
Thanks for any advice.
Translated from French
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Thanks for the replies everyone.
We aren't looking to change breeds, but we were definitely naive when it came to the Kennel Club registration. To be clear, we don't even want to breed from him—the whole point was simply to have a proper record of his ancestry! So that really takes the biscuit...
The lady from the breed club was very reassuring and almost laughed in my face, telling me we’d be happy with our "little inbred" and that, in her view, an inbreeding coefficient of 25-27% wasn't particularly high.
Anyway, it's all a bit complicated because we've already paid a deposit and the kids (who are under 6) are meant to be coming with us to pick him up today. It's a two-hour drive from ours, so we'll just have to see once we're there.
Either way, it's my first dog and there are clearly some pitfalls to avoid, apparently.
Thanks again everyone.
Even for my breed, which has quite low numbers, they recommend not exceeding 6%. Iago has a 1% inbreeding coefficient. The breeder guarantees that no dog appears twice on a pedigree. For me, that’s the bare minimum. As for Frenchies, I can understand the appeal of these little mastiff-types, but almost all molossers – perhaps with the exception of the Boxer, which is still quite athletic – suffer from issues linked to their short muzzles.
In my opinion, if a breed club isn’t working to protect the dogs' health, it’s completely pointless. I’m not ashamed to say that some breeds should be outcrossed again or simply allowed to die out.
For @Jjack2020, you should check with the breeder to see if, given the lack of prior information, they’d agree to either move your deposit to a future litter or cancel your booking altogether. If they refuse, I can see at least two ways to get your deposit back through legal action.
Because let’s face it, a 27% inbreeding coefficient is a bit much, especially since Frenchies aren't exactly a rare breed where low numbers might justify it. While controlled inbreeding can help fix certain desirable traits, at that sort of level, the main concern is that it’ll just end up concentrating genetic health defects...
As for @Kikaah, regarding the Kennel Club, they do have a disputes and appeals department and a disciplinary committee (which can, for example, temporarily or permanently suspend a kennel name or ban them from registering puppies), but in practice, their power is quite limited. The courts are much tougher than the Kennel Club when it comes to breeders who do a rubbish job.
The problem with the Kennel Club is that they don't have a legal department. I once emailed them because I’d come across an advert for puppies where the parents weren't even 12 months old, and it was from a breeder with an official affix. Their response was that it indeed wasn't right, but that the Kennel Club couldn't do anything about it. What’s the point in having rules if people can just break them with impunity?
But because breeders pay the Kennel Club to get their pups KC registered (that famous 'holy grail'), they’re somewhat protected when they mess around (I’m talking about the bad breeders, obviously!!).
If the bad breeders were actually punished, only the good ones would be left.
KC registration does have its advantages (how else would the OP have known about the inbreeding coefficient without the selective registration data?), but the Kennel Club is run by people who haven't got a clue.
(I recommend the documentary "Pedigree Dogs Exposed"; it's set here in the UK, and it shows things aren't managed much better here than in France.)
A 27% inbreeding level is higher than the percentage you'd get from a father-daughter mating.
Father x daughter = 25% inbreeding.
We can therefore assume that this cross comes from a father-daughter or brother-sister pairing... where the parents were already the result of inbreeding themselves.
Oh, brilliant... that’s just wonderful, especially for a breed like the Frenchie, which is so famous for its longevity and sturdy health...
But if you organise yourselves well, you’ll probably have time to get him to win a "beauty" show or two and use him for stud a few times so he can mix those "superb" genes with a littermate sister.
Yes, with a 3-4 year life expectancy, it’s perfectly doable...
Right, sarcasm aside, I strongly advise you not to get this puppy. I’d even go as far as to advise against this breed in particular, but hey, do as you see fit.
Um, no, absolutely, if only for the sake of their breathing... it’s a breed (along with pugs) that I think really needs a rethink... they have such a lovely temperament that should be kept, that’s all.
Genuine question, no offence intended, but does such a thing as a healthy bulldog even exist anymore? Every one I come across looks like they’re about to keel over in ten yards if they don’t get some oxygen sharpish.
If this inbreeding was authorised by the breed club, then there’s no recourse; it’s not forbidden. It really is a bit much to do that much inbreeding, especially for a breed that’s already fragile to begin with... and not being KC registered doesn't mean you're safe; it just means you're guaranteed not to have a pedigree dog.
Mind you, a high inbreeding coefficient doesn’t necessarily mean the dog will be a total mess or die young, but you should probably expect them to be a bit more delicate health-wise and perhaps have a shorter life expectancy than average—and this breed is already quite fragile as it is...
But yes, do ask to see that exemption. As for what criteria they look at, I really couldn't say...