Dog off-lead in my block of flats – what are my rights?

Missloute

08/12/2015, 08:48

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Hi everyone,

Here is my problem: there is a neighbour in my building who never keeps his dog on a lead. She is a "handbag dog" – sorry for the term, but I don't know the breed. Just to give you an idea of her size, she weighs maybe 4.5 lbs at most (about the size and build of a Chihuahua), maybe a Miniature Pinscher. As for me, I have a Golden Retriever who is nearly 12 months old and weighs about 5 stone (around 70 lbs).

So, back to the issue: whether it's outside or in the communal areas, his dog is never on a lead, and my dog pulls like crazy because he wants to go and play.

The problem is that the dog just wanders off, runs everywhere, and winds up my dog who is actually on a lead.

When we run into each other in the communal areas, or just in passing – like this morning when he was coming in and I was going out – I was still half-asleep and didn't see them through the glass door. It was absolute chaos again. My dog was lunging to go and play with her, the other dog was darting all over the place, and I almost ended up on the floor and nearly let go of my dog.

I already politely told him a couple of months ago that it would be a good idea to put his dog on a lead, and he just replied, "No, otherwise she chokes herself on her collar." 🤪... I mean, there are other types of harnesses and things! I told him that, but he just turned a deaf ear and walked off...

Sometimes I'm coming out of the lift with my dog and the neighbour is at the postboxes (which are inside the building) with his dog off-lead, and then it's just total mayhem. I try to control my dog, but he can't control his at all, and it's just running around in circles in a tiny space.

When he goes out, the dog isn't even wearing a collar. The owner walks out with his hands in his pockets, not even carrying a lead just in case. There's no way of securing her at all. 🙅

I've already warned my landlord several times (well, my partner warned them). At 10:30 this morning, I'm going to the housing office to see the property manager who looks after my building to make a formal complaint. 😠

But what recourse do I have? I'm really fed up. I nearly fell, and I have back problems (severe lumbago following a fall, which had nothing to do with this, I should clarify – my ankle didn't like a hole in the grass!) with a twinging sciatic nerve. I've already had two rounds of anti-inflammatory jabs. If I fall again, it could leave me bedridden. One day something is going to happen: either I won't be able to hold my dog back (who is always on his lead), or I'll end up on the floor, or my dog will give the other one a swipe with his paw and hurt her. I know he'll be the one blamed, but who knows what the neighbour might say afterwards...

Thanks for any answers. Sorry for the long post and any typos there might be.

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Anonymous user Icon representing the flag French

08/12/2015, 11:23

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Hi there, How’s your dog’s recall? I keep it simple: if the other dog is on a lead, mine stays on a lead too. But if I see the other dog is off-lead, I let mine off as well. It just stops things from getting tense. Mind you, my dog has very solid recall, so I can call him back whenever I need to, rather than him just charging around with the other dog. I actually had a similar situation in my block of flats. In the communal gardens, a neighbour used to let her GSD roam free, and she was really quite nasty. She’d charge at my little Staffie while growling. The neighbour wouldn't listen at all when we asked her to put her dog on a lead. Anyway, my Staffie is an adult now (very, very sociable but a bit of a bruiser like most Staffies) so when I see her in the park now, I don't bother with the lead—I just let them sort it out themselves. The result? The other dog is scared of my Staffie (he’s way too boisterous for her, lol) and so is the owner! Now she does a U-turn whenever she spots us! I hope your problem gets sorted. If the worst comes to the worst, when you bump into your neighbour at the postboxes, just let go of the lead. Let them play for a couple of minutes and you’ll find it much easier to catch him again afterwards. You’ll see that eventually, your dog will lose interest! It’s the fact that he can’t have proper face-to-face contact with the other dog that’s making him so overexcited.

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Missloute

08/12/2015, 11:17

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@MissLoute, it’s up to your management company to take action, potentially with a recorded delivery letter, and (though I hope it doesn't come to that as it’s a bit of a nuisance) filing a report with the police. I went to the customer service office this morning—it's only two minutes from mine. I told her and she couldn't care less: "Yeah, I'll make a note of it," except we've reported it several times now... And honestly, from the way she was talking and looking, she definitely isn't just smoking cigarettes; all she was interested in was getting back to her book.

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Anonymous user Icon representing the flag French

08/12/2015, 11:16

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OK, does it mention if dogs have to be kept on a lead... or anything else about them?

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Missloute

08/12/2015, 11:13

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"Ignorance of the law is no excuse" is a well-known adage, and just as a pet is its owner’s responsibility, if someone being prosecuted could simply claim they didn't know the rules to avoid being penalised, it would be a mess. It's sad it's come to this, but litigious people will always play that card. What really counts and is legally valid are the House Rules. Plenty of management committees notify residents that dogs must be kept on a lead and so on, including in the communal grounds or gardens of the... etc. If the rule isn't explicitly written in the regulations, a neighbour can still report a nuisance if they make a complaint. Playing into the neighbour’s hands is a risk, and the little dog hasn’t done anything wrong in all this. To answer your question, the rules are pinned up in a locked glass noticeboard right opposite the letterboxes, and they were also provided in the tenancy pack when the lease was signed.

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Docline

08/12/2015, 11:12

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One of my dogs is quite small (a Coton), and I let him play with real bulldozers. He holds his own; he just curls into a ball to avoid any heavy knocks. I wouldn't leave him with a puppy, but as a rule, a small adult dog knows a few "judo" moves for playing with the big ones. They aren't made of glass, even if they are tiny.

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Anonymous user Icon representing the flag French

08/12/2015, 11:12

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MissLoute, you should contact your managing agent; it's up to them to step in, potentially by sending a recorded delivery letter, and (not that I’d wish it on you, as it’s an unpleasant thing to have to do) filing a formal complaint with the police.

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Anonymous user Icon representing the flag French

08/12/2015, 11:08

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"Ignorance of the law is no excuse" as the saying goes, and just as an owner is legally responsible for their pet, if anyone facing action could simply claim they didn't know the rules to get away with it, it would be a mess. It’s sad it’s come to this, but litigious people will always try to play that card. What actually counts and is legally binding are the House Rules. Plenty of management companies notify residents that dogs must be kept on a lead at all times, including in the communal gardens or grounds. If a specific point isn't written into the regulations, a neighbour can still cite a nuisance or a breach if they lodge a complaint. Playing into the neighbour's hands is a risk, and besides, the poor little dog hasn't done anything wrong.

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Missloute

08/12/2015, 11:04

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Mind you, does your dog get the chance to play with other dogs off-lead? It's really important!!

No, unfortunately my dog doesn't get any chances to play with other dogs off-lead. People have small dogs and they're scared of mine, or the other dogs are just too old and placid. Mind you, my dog is socialised with other dogs. There's a neighbour nearby whose dog is my dog's "girlfriend", but they only ever see each other through the gate, both standing up on their hind legs to give each other little nuzzles – she’s a little Border Collie. And at my partner's parents' place, he's allowed off-lead (with a male Golden Retriever and a female Husky-Labrador cross, though not with the Husky-Lab cross's brother because he tries to attack him, so we have to keep them in separate rooms. Don't worry though, it's a farmhouse, so he's either in the big kitchen or the lounge). But those dogs are much older than him, so they're quite calm. He doesn't try to bite at all, he just wants to play. He only played off-lead once a few months ago with an older dog who also just wanted to play (who had a great owner), but I haven't seen them since. I have to admit, Arès is a bit of a clumsy oaf. I'm at fault because I can't seem to get him to walk to heel, I agree... I can teach him tricks – the latest one is "spin" – but heeling? No chance. We’re working hard outside at the moment on "sit, wait, let’s go" before crossing the road, and he gets that. A quick story from recently: A while ago, my partner stopped at a café and it turns out the owner has a Golden too (quite far from us though, about a 2-hour drive). My partner couldn't believe his eyes – the dog was the spitting image of Arès... And it turns out it’s a small world after all: he’s actually Arès’s brother from the same litter! They had a chat and it turns out they’re exactly the same – total loonies, calm indoors but impossible to train for lead walking outside. -------------------------

Failing that, just do the same to him – let your dog loose in the hallway at the same time as his "little pooch" and that’ll probably make him think twice! :-)

No, I wouldn't do that, lol. For the simple reason that Arès is a real bulldozer, it’s just his nature. I’m mostly worried he’d hurt the other dog while trying to play, and I’ve already told the owner, who knows full well how strong Arès is... I don't want Arès to hurt another dog, that’s not what I’m after; in fact, that’s exactly what I’m always worried about. To be honest, I’m not scared of other dogs, I’m scared mine will catch them with a paw and hurt them just by trying to play...

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